I inherited a database with literally thousands of tables, queries, forms, macros, etc. So I wrote up some code that will crawl the database and print out what is dependant on what so I know what is safe to delete and then I will start my redesign. However to do that acuratly I had to recursivly loop through every control in every subform (or subreport) and I was trying to avoid having to open the objects to do that. It's functional the way it is, but I was just trying to refine it becuase some of the forms have nested subforms 5 or 6 layers deep and the load time is high.